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Suggestion: Flat Filtered Command List


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#1 theo

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Posted 17 June 2009 - 04:33 PM

I was looking at the several "speedcomps" posted on youtube. (btw creating a channel to hold them might be a good idea).
And couldn't help noticing how much time was actually spent navigating the add tool hierarchy through the context menu.
There are several good examples of clever way to speed things up there
wouldn't it be great to have some quick type command in fusion like you can see at the start of this blender 2.5 preview. (also reminds me enso launcher )

#2 ChadCapeland

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Posted 17 June 2009 - 04:39 PM

I was looking at the several "speedcomps" posted on youtube. (btw creating a channel to hold them might be a good idea).
And couldn't help noticing how much time was actually spent navigating the add tool hierarchy through the context menu.
There are several good examples of clever way to speed things up there
wouldn't it be great to have some quick type command in fusion like you can see at the start of this blender 2.5 preview. (also reminds me enso launcher )


AddTool approaches this. It's a comp script. It can be assigned to a hot key, or can be made into a non-modal dialog too. It's a little TOO flat for my taste, but it is a script and can be modified pretty easily, like into a "AddEyeonTool" and "Add3rdPartyTool" or "AddCommonTool" and "AddInfrequentTool".

- Chad

#3 alt

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 04:21 AM

I think I added this to Wishlist years ago as a faster way to spawn nodes and to call up submenus. Current menu-centric way is very slow to build a comp with, almost agonisingly so when one remember the tool but not the submenu it's inside of. Hopefully Eyeon will look at UI improvements and speedups now that big architecture changes are quite done.


Off-topic, but Blender 2.5 seems to shape up very nicely, I don't do much 3d so when I do I use Blender.

#4 theo

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 07:50 AM

Hopefully Eyeon will look at UI improvements and speedups now that big architecture changes are quite done.

Yeah, there's lot to be exited about all the things that can be improved in fusion's aging ui.
Revamping fusion ui could prove to be an excellent initiative if you look at how Nuke and Houdini recent increased fame also coincide with a major ui architecture change.

#5 pingking

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 09:06 AM

for a start did you try: hotkey scripts

#6 Lukasz Omasta

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 02:20 PM

To be honest I would look out there. I agree that tool navigation is a bit on the slow side but:

1. We are all used to where things are and we tend to get a bit harsh when other people move stuff around.
Same goes for UI. Look at 3d Max. They keep all in more or less the same place.
2. Sorry but neither spotlight search nor a context menu like maya is a workable solution. There are just too
many tools around there. If you use some more than other you have the title bar. And this is a wonderful
place. Maybe it could be improved with adding images not only abbreviations but that is the only thing I would
consider changing.

Fusion is just too option rich. There are loads of tools so no wonder. For me the only solution is two new monitors.
One for Vectroscope, Waveform etc. generated with Ultrascope from Blackmagic, one for bins with all the tools
in their very nice form that reminds shake a bit with two views for masks and such, one for flow and tool settings only
and the last one for a floating full screen reference view.

For now I have two monitors. The flow/setting one and Eizo for reference.
Now I just need to find the money for two new screens, Ultrascope, converter and SLI cards :)

#7 theo

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 04:58 PM

1. We are all used to where things are and we tend to get a bit harsh when other people move stuff around.
Same goes for UI. Look at 3d Max. They keep all in more or less the same place.
2. Sorry but neither spotlight search nor a context menu like maya is a workable solution. There are just too
many tools around there. If you use some more than other you have the title bar. And this is a wonderful
place. Maybe it could be improved with adding images not only abbreviations but that is the only thing I would
consider changing.

Fusion is just too option rich. There are loads of tools so no wonder. For me the only solution is two new monitors.

funny how when one mention "ui changes" peoples often understand "moving things around".
I was more thinking of the kind of ui changes that allow peoples to moves things were they want them to be, and precisely on other monitors.
Fusion's current ui is extremely restrictive when it comes to multi-display configuration. and is just plain unusable in some screen configuration. (different screen heights for example).
I think it's about time for fusion to get a modular ui. Fancy icons is definitely not the thing I'm waiting for.

btw thanks for the tip chad, AddTool doesn't look bad (how could I miss that :huh:)

#8 Lukasz Omasta

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 01:16 AM

Theo, sorry but first you mention spotlight type search for add tool and when I say
that I think it wouldn't work to well, you convince me that you meant modular ui.
Be consequent.
I agree that modular ui would be a nice addition, and in my opinion so would be integrating
bins into the flow/timeline/spline row but if you look at new nuke the biggest change is
that they made ui by default more Shake/Fusion like.

As far as I remember modular UI is on the wishlist and as I said, this is a good idea.
The only problem I see is better "add tool" tool. You just need to be very careful there.
Maybe reorganisation is a good idea for start, maybe a short cut like Fu6 has ctrl+rmb to choose
where to connect the tools for adding new tools (shift+rmb that would display tool menu)?

I only think that such change is not an easy one to make, especially if you want to make user life
easier not harder.

#9 theo

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 05:19 AM

Theo, sorry but first you mention spotlight type search for add tool and when I say
that I think it wouldn't work to well, you convince me that you meant modular ui.
Be consequent.

Sorry, I though you were reacting to my last post.
If you look closer at the references I had posted regarding the add tool suggestion, it's quite different from a spotlight search.
It's en entirely different architecture: spotlight throw a search query as you hit enter. I was talking of a list being filtered in real time.
and it happens to be already available like Chad said (thanks chad ;) ) in the addTool script.
You should try it if you haven't yet and... it does work very well ! (it just need to be assigned to a hotkey to be usable).

I agree that modular ui would be a nice addition, and in my opinion so would be integrating
bins into the flow/timeline/spline row...

With a proper modular ui, there would be no need to integrate bins into flow/timeline/spline panel, you would just drag the bin tab into that panel.

...but if you look at new nuke the biggest change is
that they made ui by default more Shake/Fusion like.

When I advocate for a major ui overhaul I'm not talking about cosmetic change (not sure what you mean by "making default ui more shake/fusion like - Nuke is light-years ahead of fusion when it comes to their -cross-platform- ui framework)
but rather software design implementation that would help fusion deliver the immense power it has in a more efficient and elegant way to the user.

Adopting a modular ui would be an excellent start, but node manipulation is another challenging area that would definitely also deserve some extra attention...
for example:
. Faster way to paste/duplicate with/out down/up stream. (Nodejoe has some very useful methods that I miss in fusion...)
. Faster way to move branches without having to select upstream/downstream nodes first. (as seen in houdini node handling)
. Tightening the integration of the current Addtool script functionality. (tab menu in houdini being a great example)
would both already greatly enhance the comp building process.

There are some very clever and interesting design patterns out there that are worth considering if eyeon ever decide to free fusion from it's aging ui and deliver a cutting edge user experience of the same level of quality of what's lying under the hood.
I would just love to see the smart brains at eyeon come up with something and take the lead in that domain too. :D
Fu6 brings lots of new exiting tools, I hope fu7 will bring a user experience up to today/tomorrow standard.

#10 Attila Sziklai

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 07:01 AM

I second that Houdini style tool selection. I love it in Houdini and really miss it from Fusion.
Could this be done by scripting? (categorized tool listing; filtering by pressing prosthetic letters etc.)

#11 ChadCapeland

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 12:02 PM

I second that Houdini style tool selection. I love it in Houdini and really miss it from Fusion.
Could this be done by scripting? (categorized tool listing; filtering by pressing prosthetic letters etc.)


The adding of tools like that can definitely be done with scripting.

The bits about how you connect tools and such in the flow? Not so much.

Forget dockable UI elements, the stuff we have is really nice, just open up multiple views, and it not so bad. Could be better? Sure, but it's not that bad. I'd prefer changes to how the flow itself works/looks, and changes to the UI for the 3D system.

But if you told me I had to choose between an optical flow toolset and UI changes, I'd say I was happy with the UI. I really don't think it's as bad as everyone else seems to.

#12 theo

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Posted 19 June 2009 - 01:08 PM

Forget dockable UI elements, the stuff we have is really nice, just open up multiple views, and it not so bad.

depends for who.. if like me you have one of your screens rotated in portrait mode for example : (yummy for long properties list, coding and such.)
it get worse than bad, it gets plain unusable.
I mean cmon, you can't f** float any windows outside of the main fusion window (except for a useless new view window) how bad is that ? how is this suppose to adapt to multi-display environments at all?
it's right there up to the standard of let say a photoshop 5.5 or something.

#13 bfloch

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Posted 19 October 2009 - 05:23 PM

The biggest flaw with the AddTool was that Fusion did not spawn the tools at the last clicked position like the general tool adding behavior in 5.2 or 5.3.

But this was corrected in 6.0 and it rocks my world! I've set it to CRTL-SPACE hotkey and modified the add tool version in two ways:
- Short names as default
- Replace missing Shortnames with first 4 characters of Tool name if possible instead of ???

I hope it's ok for eyeon to share this modified script here.

It works perfectly for me. I've started a huge enriched version of such a tool some time ago which allows you to spawn branches etc. but for now the Add Tool Mod will do.

I think that Houdini's TAB Menu could be simulated. My fingers are itching but I have just to much work with my graduation right now.

Cheers

Attached Files



#14 Gringo

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Posted 20 October 2009 - 11:39 AM

The biggest flaw with the AddTool was that Fusion did not spawn the tools at the last clicked position like the general tool adding behavior in 5.2 or 5.3.
But this was corrected in 6.0 and it rocks my world! I've set it to CRTL-SPACE hotkey and modified the add tool version in two ways:

Thanks Blazej!
This modified version is much better!

#15 Daniel Koch

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Posted 22 October 2009 - 03:15 AM

I hope it's ok for eyeon to share this modified script here.

Absolutely - it's great to see people improving the stock scripts, and sharing them.

Your improvements inspired me to do some more work on it myself. Here's my version, with some changes:

  • Main change is, it shortens the list to include only matching tools, as you type.
  • I removed the ShortNames checkbox, and had it search both names and shortnames.
  • It now searches anywhere in the tool's name (and shortname), so you can type "blu" and get all the various blur tools.
  • From the resulting list, it selects the tool whose name or shortname starts with your text.
  • More text editing keys work, like Ctrl+Backspace to clear the text behind the cursor.
  • Fixed the last-selected-tool feature, so that's selected the next time you open it.
I now like this version so much, I've even officially assigned it the Ctrl+Space hotkey :)

Attached File  Add Tool.eyeonscript.txt   5.47KB   53 downloads




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